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Primarily this was focused on dealing with the problem of ship 'rise' in larger combats and especially when using tighter formations.
Reducing ship size by 50% basically eliminates this problem.
The other side effect of reducing ship size is the much better sense of scale that smaller ships give to space combat. Battles have a better sense of 'realism' and come off as much less cartoony.
The link above illustrates this with a number of screenshots.
The main negative factor in this is the need to convert all current shipsets into the smaller format. Not particularly difficult, but a pretty time consuming task.
I am in the process of doing that now.
In addition to the stock races, I will also be doing a number of the cooler and more detailed addon sets, including:
In addition to just scaling down the ships, I have also been experimenting with a number of improvements to the combat visuals including new shield and beam effects.
These are based off Balance mod 1.15+ files, so if you are using the stock game, then you should install the latest BM to get the full set of improvements.
Overall the aim is to create a more up-to-date and cinematic combat experience.
In terms of progress, I am roughly about 75% complete, and should have the full set ready for upload early next week. SEV Visual Mods:
Black UI Reduced Size Shipsets Back to top
The sets are basically done, and I've even added in the Cardassian and Ferengi, for my mates over at the Warp 10 mod.
I've also done small, unobtrusive versions of all neutral, alliance and extra races flag/status icons.
Massive space billboards, be gone!
However the weapon and shield effects require changes to the BitmapEffects_SpaceCombat.txt, and Components.txts, and I'm concerned that this may not play nicely with PBW games.
I believe that PBW games use the Host computer's files for turn processing, so it shouldn't be a problem, but I'm not sure of this.
Its certainly possible to use the reduced scale sets without the effects, but the stock-sized beams and explosions look a bit bloated on the smaller ships.
I'm not currently in any PBW games, so I'm wondering if someone who is, would mind giving it a try for me?
As a bonus to the first person who can test this out for me I will add (downsize, align and tune up engines and firing glows) a shipset of your choice to the list above!
Unfortunately, changing the components.txt file results in mismatched data files. I can run turns with changes to the empire file, however. Changing the picture folder also lets me play the turn. Back to top
Unfortunately, changing the components.txt file results in mismatched data files. I can run turns with changes to the empire file, however. Changing the picture folder also lets me play the turn.
Thanks for having a look at this, Lorq.
Its looking like the Components.txt changes may not be usable for PBW games. This is unfortunate as this controls visual portrayal of beam speed and duration.
Lorq seems to be not having a problem using the altered BitmapEffects_SpaceCombat.txt file though, which is great news, as this controls the dimensions of the tactical combat effects.
This lets us scale the effects appropriate to the reduced scale ships.
I am going to let him test this out for a few days longer, just to make sure though, before uploading the set.
As his 'Bonus' he asked for the Kzinti Addon set.
Not one of my favorites, for sure, but I will include this in the pack. SEV Visual Mods:
Black UI Reduced Size Shipsets Back to top
The one thing I would request is that you respect hull size difference within the shipset. A lot, eg the advent, do have that much difference or more where they come from. Back to top
The one thing I would request is that you respect hull size difference within the shipset. A lot, eg the advent, do have that much difference or more where they come from.
I've certainly done my best to maintain relative sizes between different hull sizes, but there is a huge amount of variation between all of the non-stock shipsets.
A certain compromise must be made, or you could end up with two cruisers fighting, and one is 5 times bigger than the other!
The bottom line is that in the game, the same ship class of different races will have roughly the same tonnage and relative component capacity, so I have tried to set up the ships to keep a certain visual consistency.
For game play reasons you should be able to look at a battle that includes an unfamiliar shipset, and know roughly at a glance the relative size/class/potential power of the various ships.
Often this will mean that the relative differences in size may be different than in the source material.
I think that's unavoidable.
Otherwise users of the Starwars set would get a frigate about the same size as stock, but their dreadnought (super star destroyer) would fill the whole screen! SEV Visual Mods:
Black UI Reduced Size Shipsets Back to top
So far no reports of issues when using the only the BitmapEffects_SpaceCombat file for PBW games.
I will include the altered Components.txt file with the upload, for those of you who wish to get the changes to beam duration and speed and the different colored shield effects, but this file will cause problems for multi-player (if your host doesn't use the same file).
Without this, your shields will be stock green color when hit by APBs, but you can still get the other effects as seen in this shot.
I have also added another effect (which you can get without using the Components file).
Upon destruction of a ship, there is now a chance that the reactors will breach, releasing bright lightning flashes of charged radioactive plasma.
The cruiser above did not manage to escape it's pursuers, and here we can see it in the last stages of its death throes, bright blue bolts of energy crackling over its hull...
Just waiting for a report from Marhawkman to confirm that there are no problems with turn processing for PBW games, and then I will upload the set. SEV Visual Mods:
Black UI Reduced Size Shipsets Back to top
It took me a while to get everything all sorted out and get the data files tested to make sure there were no conflicts with multiplayer games, but I think everything is all sorted now.
During the trial period I also took the opportunity to add a few more addon empires to the set.
So it now consistst of:
Reduced scale shipsets for ALL stock races, plus the following addon shipsets:
8472
Advent
Amarr
Borg
Breen
Caldari (Revised for 1.07!)
Cardassian
Dominion
FedTNG
Ferengi
Gallente
Gorn
Gurak -Full set included!
Hydran
Klingon
Kushan
Kzinti
Lyran
Minbari
Minmater (New for 1.06!)
Romulan
Taiidan
Tholian
Vaygr
Wraith
In addition to reducing and standardizing the shipsizes, I also corrected a myriad of problems with ship alignment, base radius, firing points and engine glows. (I didn't however, add complete glowsets for ships that never had them)
Many of these sets also include new Race portraits to replace grainy low res-screen grabs, and maintain a degree of consistency with the art style of the stock sets.
In addition...
Complete sets of small, less obtrusive flags/status icons, for all stock, neutral, above-noted addon, Alliance and additional races (228 flags in total) are also included.
Bonus extras:To the latest version of the pack I have also added shipset recolors, and the latest version of the G'Urak shipset.
Note: To reduce file size, this set does NOT include all the models/textures for the listed addon races. If you want to use them, grab them from the shipyards and install them as usual.
You may experience problems if you use the Reduced Scale elements without having the full shipset. I would advise you to go through the sets after you install, and remove any that you don't have the full shipset for.
Or better yet, go grab all the ones you don't already have.
Variety is good, and there are some amazing sets in this group!
One thing I might add on using the smaller ships, is that though the ships are about half the size, the movement speed is unchanged.
This means that it the ships may seem to be moving faster than usual.
I usually turn the speed down to 1/2 or 1/4, as this gives a better impression that the ships are ponderous battlewagons, rending the fabric of space and blasting each other to bits.
The slower pace also allows me to take a bit more time to zoom in closer to appreciate the great detail on some of the addon models, and the enhanced shield and combat effects. SEV Visual Mods:
Black UI Reduced Size Shipsets Back to top
Ok, things seem a bit quiet over here, but I made a few changes over the holidays, so I figure I may as well upload them.
In addition to fixing a few minor inconsistencies, the major change is to planet size.
While I really liked the sense of 'space' that the smaller planets gave the system map, one by product was that it also reduced the planet size on the tactical screen. With larger planets this didn't seem to be a problem, but it did become noticeable with small and tiny planets.
This isn't strictly a problem with this mod, of course.
Since the ships are half size, as well as the planets, the relative proportions are identical to the stock game.
But still, it doesn't look cool so I played around with different options looking for a way to make smaller planets look bigger in tactical battles without going back to the overly large balls on the main map.
The solution I came up with was to change the size progression between the different planet sizes.
Basically, I kept the size of the tiny planets the same as stock (meaning they will appear 2x size when using the smaller shipsets) then increased the size of each successive planet by only .5 (instead of 1).
This results in a reduction in overall size between the larger planets, but this isn't really noticeable in tactical combat. Most importantly though, smaller planets don't look stupidly tiny!
It does mean that these are somewhat larger than the original smaller planets (Example screenshot ).
I think its an extremely worthwhile tradeoff.
Here are some shots. The first shows the new scale on the system map. The planets are slight larger than the previous versions, but much smaller than the overly massive stock ones.
The second pic shows a couple of destroyers orbiting a small rock world.
In stock and with the previous small planets mod, that planet would be half that size, which just looked wrong
I also increased the atmospheric shading around the planets slight, to make judging the atmosphere type a bit easier
Thoughts?
In addition to the above noted, it also includes a few revised flags (slowly weeding out all the 'flatter', non-alpha blend ones), and some new race portraits. SEV Visual Mods:
Black UI Reduced Size Shipsets
Last edited by gurachn on Sun Jan 29, 2012 11:11 am; edited 3 times in total Back to top
<<Edit - All the following is now included in the Full 1.071 pack, so if you have grabbed that, no need to get the following>>
Ah, I almost forgot.
This version also adds an additional shipset, the Conflux.
I was looking for another organic race, but had avoided this one previously due to its shocking hot pink coloration.
Hard to take an alien race seriously that dresses like a 14 year old girl!
Anyway, I batched it through PS and changed the scheme to a more agressive looking scheme.
It looks very cool in game, like some breed of creatures that can internalize nuclear reactions, and is now my favorite organic race.
While I'm on the subject, I may as well include a few more recolor jobs for anyone who is interested.
Both the Taidan and the Kushan are terrific sets, but they come in bright yellow and lime green respectively.
I'm not that keen on bright neon ships, so I toned them both down a bit too.
.
I will also throw in another slightly changed shipset. The Hydran Kingdom is another aquatic/organic looking set, with some amazing looking ship models but unfortunately the units and spacestation didn't quite seem to match color and style wise.
I swapped these out and color matched the set a bit better.
If you are interested in these changes, you can grab the recolored/altered bits here:
Shipset_Recolors.rar
This includes only the changed elements for the above noted shipsets. If you don't already have the full set, grab them at the links above.
They are all nicely detailed, run smoothly are well worth having.
<<Edit>>
One final point.
I just realized that the version of the G'Urak shipset in the shipyards is quite an old version, and is different to the most recent one as used in this reduced scale pack.
There are a number of new ships, and a new set of bases, including:
I have submitted a request to update the file, but in the meantime, you can grab the most recent version here:
Gurak_106.rar SEV Visual Mods:
Black UI Reduced Size Shipsets
Last edited by gurachn on Sun Jan 29, 2012 11:14 am; edited 6 times in total Back to top
Hey Gurachn, the recolors download link doesn't seem to work. Sounds like it'd be pretty good!
Also, how tricky is it to reduce mod shipsets to the standard you're doing here? I'm new to SEV and all, so don't know much about the tools used, but I thought I'd at least ask that first before making requests. Back to top
Hey Gurachn, the recolors download link doesn't seem to work. Sounds like it'd be pretty good!
Also, how tricky is it to reduce mod shipsets to the standard you're doing here? I'm new to SEV and all, so don't know much about the tools used, but I thought I'd at least ask that first before making requests.
Hey Fishsteak,
Thats weird, not sure why but the file seems to have gone AWOL.
I re-uploaded it, so it should be fine now.
If you are just talking about reducing the scale, its not tricky at all - Just a bit time consuming.
Basically its just a matter of reducing the 'Starting Scale (X,Y,Z)', and requires nothing fancier than notepad.
The complicating element is that the non-stock sets often vary dramatically in shipsize.
To ensure that your adjustments are consistent with the rest of the sets you can use a utility called ShipSetView which is included with the game in the Utilities directory.
It allows you to open and view multiple sets at the same time so you can ensure that all ships of the same class are roughly equivelent in size.
Its really useful and pretty easy to use, but not super intuitive. If you read the included ShipSetViewer_Controls.txt you should be able to get a handle on it pretty easily though.
Ah, okay. There are around 12 or so that I've liked the most. I may try and do a few, but if you're inclined toward any of them, awesome!
Arackterra
Aragonite
Breen
GTA (I like my FreeSpace stuff -- some brightness/contrast on the textures and they should be much nicer)
ISC
Minmatar
Noah Colony
Pakmara (B5 is not my personal favorite story/contentwise, but it's a good shipset to adapt for other races -- these might serve as Starflight Elowan or Thrynn or something for me)
The Star Wars ones (Republic, Seppie, Sith)
VUX
And thanks for putting those recolors up!
EDIT: Very nice work! Really redeems the Kushan and Taiidan, especially -- those original textures were just too much. But just out of curiosity, why Kushan over Hiigaran? Isn't the Hiigaran just a more detailed update of the Kushan? (I haven't played Homeworld or anything, just totally going off looks.) Back to top
Ah, okay. There are around 12 or so that I've liked the most. I may try and do a few, but if you're inclined toward any of them, awesome!
Arackterra
Aragonite
Breen
GTA (I like my FreeSpace stuff -- some brightness/contrast on the textures and they should be much nicer)
ISC
Minmatar
Noah Colony
Pakmara (B5 is not my personal favorite story/contentwise, but it's a good shipset to adapt for other races -- these might serve as Starflight Elowan or Thrynn or something for me)
The Star Wars ones (Republic, Seppie, Sith)
VUX
And thanks for putting those recolors up!
EDIT: Very nice work! Really redeems the Kushan and Taiidan, especially -- those original textures were just too much. But just out of curiosity, why Kushan over Hiigaran? Isn't the Hiigaran just a more detailed update of the Kushan? (I haven't played Homeworld or anything, just totally going off looks.)
I may eventually do some of the SW, but I'm not really that interested in playing those ships. After the prequels I got a bit sick of the whole thing.
Also, once you start playing with shipsets with detailed models and textures, the ones that aren't quite as good start to stand out.
With the revised effects tactical battles can look pretty sweet, so I tend to zoom in to the point where the disparity becomes noticeable.
Some of the ones on your list don't hold up that well.
Actually, neither do the stock ones either. Luckily there are enough top-notch addon sets to fill out the roster!
The Noah have some nice ships but they seem to be from a number of different races and the look is a bit inconsistent.
The ISC is decently modelled and detailed, but the textures are as colorful as christmas trees, with lots of colored lights and sparkly bits. Not really my taste, and requiring a lot more work than a simple recolor.
Actually, the Breen are included in the set above.
Its an awesome set - a bit too awesome perhaps...
I'm not sure what the poly count on those ships are, but it bogs down my machine (i7, 8GB ram, SSD) like no other, with a notable impact on fps.
I don't know the Minmatar set, but the other Eve shipsets are very nice. Where did you get it?
As for the Hiigaran, I think it has some of the coolest shipmodels going, but I never really liked the carrier, freighter or unit models. I also wasn't that keen on the pastel orange color scheme (Homeworld as a whole had awesome models, but somewhat unusual color choices).
When I started getting back into PBW gaming a few years ago I assembled a shipset (with the permission of the original authors) to use for my empire. The Gurak uses a lot of the Hiigaran models, so I never bothered to re-scale the original set.
If you like the look of the ships and don't really mind that they don't follow the canon paint scheme, you may want to have a look at that one. SEV Visual Mods:
Black UI Reduced Size Shipsets
Last edited by gurachn on Sun Jan 29, 2012 2:01 am; edited 1 time in total Back to top
Yeah, I'm in the same boat on a lot of those points. I don't care for SW stuff, myself, either -- I just like lots of enemy variety, and, for better or worse, a lot of the SW ship models are good quality.
So I started, and, eh, you're right on the counterintuitive bit, and on some of them not really holding up that well under scrutiny compared to some others... but I think I'm getting the hang of it, and I'm working on them.
I think I'll start with Aragonite, because it's the only really sincerely crystally one I've seen, and it's a good one to learn on. Needs engine glows, apparently, too, but I dunno if I'll dive into the deep end first.
Anyway, I'll do some and, if you'd like, send them for inclusion/scrutiny.
On the other stuff, I actually kinda like that garish look on the ISC! Maybe I'm a softie like that. We'll see if it still looks good to me later.
I got the Minmatar somewhere on these forums... found it. Wow, that was obscure -- search doesn't pull it up. It's here:
If you are just talking about reducing the scale, its not tricky at all - Just a bit time consuming.
Basically its just a matter of reducing the 'Starting Scale (X,Y,Z)', and requires nothing fancier than notepad.
The complicating element is that the non-stock sets often vary dramatically in shipsize.
To ensure that your adjustments are consistent with the rest of the sets you can use a utility called ShipSetView which is included with the game in the Utilities directory.
I see on some you adjust the base model radius. When should I do that? Back to top
Yeah, I'm in the same boat on a lot of those points. I don't care for SW stuff, myself, either -- I just like lots of enemy variety, and, for better or worse, a lot of the SW ship models are good quality.
So I started, and, eh, you're right on the counterintuitive bit, and on some of them not really holding up that well under scrutiny compared to some others... but I think I'm getting the hang of it, and I'm working on them.
I think I'll start with Aragonite, because it's the only really sincerely crystally one I've seen, and it's a good one to learn on. Needs engine glows, apparently, too, but I dunno if I'll dive into the deep end first.
Anyway, I'll do some and, if you'd like, send them for inclusion/scrutiny.
On the other stuff, I actually kinda like that garish look on the ISC! Maybe I'm a softie like that. We'll see if it still looks good to me later.
I got the Minmatar somewhere on these forums... found it. Wow, that was obscure -- search doesn't pull it up. It's here:
Those Eve sets are really outstanding.
This one is an interesting one too. Some weird skinny ships, but really nicely detailed. Bit of an fps hit, but worth it for sweet models like these.
I had the viewer open anyway so I shrunk it down.
You can grab the resized version here if you like (just the _XFileClasses.txt).
I suspect that once you get a really close at amazing sets like this it will lower your tolerance for the simpler ones!
You may also start to find that you run your battles at slower speed, zoomed in to see these beauties blastin each other to glowing scrap with hellfire!
Pretty soon you may find that your have all the stock races moved to a different directory, to stop them appearing in games. SEV Visual Mods:
Black UI Reduced Size Shipsets Back to top
I see on some you adjust the base model radius. When should I do that?
Hmm... Yeah.
Well, I started putting together a set of notes for reducing the shipsets a while ago, but there didn't seem to be much interest so I never did anything with it.
Its pretty basic, but here is what I have:
Shipset size adjustment 101
This describes the basic process for using ShipSetViewer (found in your .../Space Empires V/Utilities folder) and Notepad (or similar basic text editor).
It assumes that the ship model is relatively well centered, and has no issues with missing or misaligned engine glows or firing points.
Set up the workspace:
(Note all commands below should be typed without quote marks.)
- Open the target shipset with ShipSetViewer (in windowed mode)
-Type “C” then “L”, (No quotes) to remove the annoying lines.
- Open a benchmark set (I use the Gurak set, as it has fairly regular shaped ships, and I like it!)
I usually align them so that you can compare the first (leftmost) 3 ships of both sets.
Open the target ship’s ‘_XFileClasses.txt’
Round 1 - Basic Resizing:
1. Select the ShipSetViewer for the target set
2. Type: “ ` ” (-Tilde. You must type this before and after all commands. If you forget you will get weird lines and dancing ships!)
3. Then type: “List 1”
This will bring up the model details for the first set, the frigate.
The numbers you are interested in at this point are next to ‘Scale:’
These 3 values correspond to the Starting Scale X/Y/Z in the _XFileClasses.txt file.
Compare the target frigate to the benchmark one and decide roughly how much you need to reduce the size.
E.g. if the target ship looks twice the size of the benchmark, and has a Scale of .22, .22, .22, then you probably want to set change the scale to .11, .11, .11
To do that:
4. Type:” ` ”
5. Then type: CS .11
This will change all of the X/Y/Z values
6. Then Type: “ ` “
You will now see the new size of the model. If it doesn’t look right, repeat steps 4-6 until you are happy.
7. Type these new values into the _XFileClasses.txt.
Now change the Base Model Radius (BMR). This influences ship size on the system map.
8. Count the number of squares on the grid from the center of the model to its tip. Use this number to replace the current Base Model Radius value on your _XFileClasses.txt
9. Multiply you Base Model Radius value by 3, then use this number to replace the ‘Explosion Radius’ Value on your _XFileClasses.txt. This will give you an appropriately sized explosion ring when your ship gets killed. With long skinny models I generally reduce this value a bit.
10. Once you are happy with all the models and BMRs, the look at the size of the engine glow. If it looks too small or big, adjust the numbers accordingly.
11. Continue steps 1-10 for the remaining ships.
12. Close and save the _XFileClasses.txt
This completes the rough setup for the target set. Now we do the fine-tuning/Checking.
Round 2 - Volume/BMR check, engine glow size:
Open the target set and set up your workspace as before.
13. Type: “ o “
This will show Base Model Radius for all models as a fine red circle. This circle should pretty much perfectly enclose the ship from nose to tail. If it’s a bit off (i.e. due to model misalignment) don’t worry too much, but try to get it as close as you can. With long, skinny sets you should make the circle a bit smaller than the overall length.
14. Type “ F2”
This will bring up the sideview.
15. Use the numberpad ” - “ key to zoom in for a side view. You will have to use the down arrow key to move the view back.
16. Type “ S “
This will start the ships rotating and allow you to get a good idea of the depth of the ship. Some ships look tiny from overhead, but are very deep.
16. Adust the size of the model if you feel that the overall volume of the target ship is different to that of the Benchmark ship
17. Make any adustments you feel necessary to the Base Model Radius
18. Do this for all remaining ships, close and save.
It’s possible to do all this in a single stage, of course, but I find a two round process results in less errors. With more unusual sets, even one or two more adjustment rounds may be useful.
I noticed also that units are relatively large -- pretty much on a different scale than the ships. Should I follow the same radius rule with them?
EDIT: Also, just to clarify, radius is measured from the actual model, or from the radius of the red circle shown around the model from pressing 'o'? Back to top
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